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Title: Id game models (Models galore) Post by: MoJoJoJoe on 2003-06-04, 00:21 In other words: Do you want to play a Zombie man or shot gun guy. Or any Man shaped model that isnt any bigger than tank jr. This would sort of make gen more universal not just heros or major bad guys but the ones yo like to shoot at from the original games. Like all suggestions this one doesn't need to be done but I think it would put the Gen in Generations. Also Wire head has alredy made an impressive earth model who says it cant be done with other characters from wolf or doom or quake 1 or 2. Are you up to the challenge tab and pheonix. This idea COULD BE STARTED ON WHENEVER AFTER .99C DURING OR NEVER.
Here are the man like models list. Wolf: 1.Gaurd 2.SS 3.Officer 4.Mutant 5.Uber Mutant 6.Trans Grosse 7.Dr. Schabbs Doom: 8.Zombieman 9.Shotgun dude 10.Chaingun guy 11.Imp (done) 12.Archon (done) etc etc. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Footman on 2003-06-04, 01:34 Not to be negative or anything, but, that's the dumbest idea I've ever heard of.
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Tabun on 2003-06-04, 02:36 No it's not, by far, foots :)
There was one idea about having a class that allowed you to play as a strogg gladiator or something? Oh wait, doesn't sound all that different from this :) Several reasons why this seems like a bad idea to me: 1. I don't see how it puts the Gen en Generations, considering that you could never play any of those characters in the original games.. 2. I'm up to lots of challenges, but I'm personally up to my ears in modelling work, and Gen is not the only thing I wish to work on in my short but hopefully endeavouring life. 3. Also, you do realize, I hope, that the list the list would consist of well over 20 characters (most of them illegal to reproduce in any way) that would require fully animated, high quality models to get the effect you're obviously aiming for. That would mean four years of work, and considering no-one of the WH team has all that much experience in animating organics.. add some more years to get into it ;] 4. There's absolutely no way anyone could have more than 5 minutes of fun, running around as a slow and awfully harmless strogg light guard, or gaurd.. if you prefer. 5. The Moon still revolves around the Earth. Other than that, it does sound like fun. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Phoenix on 2003-06-04, 03:08 Well, there's two ways to interpret this.
First, if Mojo means "can we play AS the monsters", meaning can we be the actual monsters from the game, then no, due to legal reasons and the impossibility of coding that much extra stuff. The second option, if Mojo means "Can we make and use character models from the old games to use for the appropriate Generation" then the answer is most definitely YES, with a few constraints: First, the new animation stance code for certain weapons (pistols, BFG's, dualgats, melee attacks) has to be completed, implemented, and the SDK (software developers kit) made for it. After that the models themselves would have to be made and skinned. They would be restricted to the same rules as a standard player character (like Doom, Ranger, etc) in that they'll play like any other standard model. That means same hitbox, same health, same weapons. They're player models and that's what they'll be in-game. That's all they'll be - a model. They'll be restricted to a single class, same as any of the others. We've already paved the way for this kind of 3rd party model support, but an SDK will NOT be released with 99c for 3rd party models since the new animation frames are not in yet. Those will follow in a later release. In the mean time, once 99c is released you WILL be able to use any of the existing standard Quake 3 player models and their accompanying skins, as well as any third party skins for those existing models. To summarize, here's what's upcoming in model support: 99c - stock Q3 player models supported, full skin support. post 99c - full 3rd party model and skin support, additional animation frames. So if you want to BE a Shotgun Zombie, then no. If you want to play as the Doom class with a model LOOKING AND SOUNDING LIKE a Shotgun Zombie, then yes, in a future release. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: McDeth on 2003-06-04, 07:41 Hrm.....sounds like a load to me....tennis anyone?
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Vadertime on 2003-06-04, 08:29 This is damned confusing. How can you BE a shotgun zombie anyway? Do you mean using artwork and sounds directly ripped from the old games? Since a zombie was a nonplayer character with it's own separate code, how could you ever BE one anyway, even in DOOM? I wonder, could you take DOOM and change the images used for the players into shotgun zombie frames? I think my cousin once used dehacked to make his player look like a bullet clip. He did so to cheat against his older brother in deathmatch. As far as monster models goes, somebody should make a TankSr.
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Phoenix on 2003-06-04, 09:02 What are you BLIND? :thud:
"BE a monster" defined as: Existing as a monster-type entity, with monster characteristics, doing monster type things. described as: Running around a level, moaning, getting shot and dying easily. Carrying 1 and exactly one weapon (in the case of the Shotgun zombie) or a few strictly defined weapons (rocket launcher, blaster, and machinegun in the case of a Q2 tank). examples: Go take a look at the Revenge of the Stroggos mod for Quake 2 where you played AS MONSTERS. "LOOKING AND SOUNDING LIKE a monster" defined as: Existing as a standard Generations playerclass, with standard player characteristics, doing player-type things. described as: Play generations 99b as your favorite class and imagine yourself as whatever monster model, making whatever monster sounds of whatever monster you fancy from the original game it came from while doing the EXACT SAME THINGS you're capable of doing in 99b now as that class. examples: Play Quake 2 using the CD2000 model. Look like a cyberdemon, roar like a cyberdemon, shoot Quake 2 weapons, die like any other Quake 2 gumby. 1) YOU CANNOT AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO BE A MONSTER. EVER. 2) YOU CAN AND WILL BE ABLE TO USE MONSTER-ISH PLAYER MODELS IN THE FUTURE. Ok now can I POSSIBLY make it any clearer than that? If you don't understand what meant by now then PLEASE do not continue reading this thread or responding to it because I won't explain it a third time! :angry: Title: Re: Id game models Post by: games keeper on 2003-06-04, 12:00 what pho wants to say is .
if soeone makes a model like on polycount you can play with it in gen. this means if someone makes an imp for quake 3 . you can play with that model in gen. you can not trow fireballs or scratch your oponent . you will still go on the sme speed as doom. you will carrie every weapon that doom can carrie . (nothing more , nothing less ) if I have to explain it simplier then this I dont know how . by the way , there is already an imp , arachnatron , revanant model for quake 3 . Title: Re: Id game models Post by: ReBoOt on 2003-06-04, 12:50 I don't think you need to explain anything Games Keeper, Phoenix explained it very good ;)
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: McDeth on 2003-06-04, 19:29 Me grabs his racket and proceeds over to Mojo......
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: OmEgA-X on 2003-06-05, 02:00 :idiot: :laser: :wall: TOO MANY DUMB PEOPLE! NOT ENOUGH BFG AMMO.
--------------------- anyway..that'd be a pretty cool idea. i know i'd have fun running around fraggin peoplew with my chainsaw as an imp. IMP'S REVENGE :lol: Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Vadertime on 2003-06-09, 08:20 Well, DUUUHHHHH--UUUHHHHH!!!! I know you can't BE a monster. What I'm wondering is how you'll make things to shoot at for resurgence mode. Omega X reveals his extreme stupidity for calling people stupid over a serious technical question. I suppose he's some kind of lawyer too. Well X, maybe you'll enlighten us all about all the details of copyright laws. Funny I seem to remember a patch for the old Quake that let people play as monsters. Did the guy that made it get sued? I also remember it sucked anyway. Maybe I'll join a game someday and beat ALL your asses as BARNEY THE PURPLE DINOSAUR!
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Phoenix on 2003-06-09, 09:35 Quote What I'm wondering is how you'll make things to shoot at for resurgence mode. Well, if that was your question, why didn't you say so in the first place? That I can answer. Resurgence will utilize a "plug-in" monster scripting system. Basically ANY player model available in Q3 (including 3rd party player models) can be included in a monster script. Server admins will author the said scripts, with a set of default scripts being available with the mod at time of download. Have you ever play the Hunt mod with the 20' tall TankJr monsters shooting rockets at you? That's a good example of what we're talking about. Let's say Server Admin A decides to download a Cyberdemon model, write a monster script, and apply it to that model. No copyright violation has occured on our part. Id allowed people to create monster-type models for player models (check out Polycount) and had no problems with our plug-in style scripting. The server admin could have just as easily used a 20' tall Crash model. Toss in a few custom themed maps, and there you have it. Since the monster code can use any player model it prevents us from falling into the same foxhole that Reborn for Q3 did. If for some reason Resurgence ever DID turn out to be foxable we only need disable the code for the gametype and Gen would be 100% legal again. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: games keeper on 2003-06-09, 12:23 I advise downloading the latest hunt mod wich includes the titan monster .
after hat I advise you download the imp , arachnatron and revanat from polycount. and set monstermodel1= imp monstermodel2 =arachnatron. monstermodel3 = revanant and then your gonna have some nostalgia fun . :) Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Vadertime on 2003-06-11, 04:56 That sounds good. What I meant about a TankSenior was of course a player model like all the others. Being TankSenior, using all the weapons like TankJunior, TankSenior would be like a tank commander but minus the folding rocketpack on the shoulder and with normal 5-digit hands instead of guns. New sounds would be a must and the model could have a big variety of skins. I just downloaded Milkshape so maybe I can make it.
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Daedalus on 2003-06-11, 09:29 Good luck, milkshape is not exactly the best thing to model with, it is nice and straight forward though.
However, you'll need something to unwrap the mesh as milkshapes unwrapper is pathetic I suggest you start off with something smaller than a complicated Tank model. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Tabun on 2003-06-11, 12:00 I completely agree with Daed there. I've been a 'modeler' for quite a bit now, but you haven't seen me trying to make a huge, complex and impressively animated model yet, eh? There's a reason for that - it's bloody hard to do :]
So gl, but don't expect anything good looking on the first run Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Phoenix on 2003-06-12, 07:32 Also, Q3 uses a tag system and 3 separate components to each model: Head, torso, and legs. Torso and legs both have separate sets of animations. Animating a model for Q3 is a lot more tricky than animating one for Q2. I've animated models for Q2 before. You just made the model pose as you want it to look in a particular frame, then cycle through your animation and tweak it. For Q3 you can't exactly do that. The torso and head tag along wherever the tag_torso is pointed in the lower.md3. The only animations shared between the legs and the torso are the death frames. I do believe you can export relative to tag positions, so what you'll probably have to do is animate those together like normal, then export the torso and legs into separate files and work out the rest of the animations independantly. There's a few tutorials out there, I'd read up on them.
As for Milkshape... I've never once succeeded in getting that program to do anything. All the weapon models I've created started out in Quake 2 Modeler as md2 files which I converted to md3's using Npherno's MD3 compiler. 3D Studio Max and Maya are the real powerhouses for making good models, but are quite costly and have a steep learning curve. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: OmEgA-X on 2003-06-12, 15:33 thats where file sharing comes into play lol :daddy:
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Vadertime on 2003-06-13, 07:04 I've already made a few unanimated models. Mind you, they're just unwrapped models with no skins or anything. Just grey things vaguely shaped how I wanted them. I've made 2 trees, 2 or 3 lights, a submachine gun, and an antitank missile launcher. If any of you can skin or otherwise adjust them I'd appreciate it. :)
Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Gnam on 2003-06-13, 21:58 I think I see what Mojo was getting at here. Gen would feel more like a id FPS crossover game than just "the Q3 guys using other guns if there were more characters from the old games. I think a more practical way to acheive this would be to have 1 extra "arena gladiator" for each class, based on the monsters rather than the heros. For example, for Doom class, you could have a "Cyberdemon Jr" model that would be about man-sized (maybe a bit bigger, liek Tank Jr) and mounted the Q3 weapons inside his arm cannon. You could also do a Hell Baron and Hell Knight skin if you wanted too. This way you would effectively have a Doom monster, but outfitted for the eternal arenas with a beleivable way of interfacing with the Q3 weapons. One of the problems with doing all of the monsters (besides too many models) is an imp or a bulldog demon looks frikin dumb holding a rocket launcher. You could make up some story about how the Vadrigar brought a cyberdemon from Deimos to the arenas and bio-engineered it to be smaller (to fit in small corridors) smarter (so it could compete with the other gladiators) and changed its arm cannon to accept ammunition from the arenas, and voila you have a single Q3 player model that can represent the body of Doom monsters. There would also not be copyright issues because it would still technically be your own original design.
Anyway, for strogg, there's allready Tank Jr. If you wanted to you could do something of a "super" strogg gaurd, that had the look of a strogg cyborg, but looked lik eit could actually kick some ass (for a long time I actually thought Visor and Gorre were supposed to be strogg). For Wolf class, the current model actually looks more like Hans Gross than JB Blaskowtz or whatever the Wolf guy's name is. Of course, just a guy in a plane grey prisoners uniform would be kinda boring, so watcha gonna do? Actually, the Fritzcreig model from TA would fit Wolf really well. For slipgate, I don't know, you could pretty much just make any old freaky thing, give it a rocket launcher, and call it a monster from Quake. You could do a zombie grunt skin for the Ranger model (that's actually something I wanted to do when I got around to it). On that matter I plan on doing a Zombieman and Shotgun guy Doom/GruntHeadModel combo skin when I get around to it. I allready have the uniform, I just have to add blood and do the head skin. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Vadertime on 2003-06-14, 05:48 I've taken screenshots of my crappy milkshake models.
I'm not sure how to upload them here though. Title: Re: Id game models Post by: Daedalus on 2003-06-14, 09:30 get yourself some free webspace somewhere and upload 'em to it
then just link to them here ^_^ Title: Re: Id game models Post by: games keeper on 2003-06-14, 14:12 to gnam.
please go check out polycount.com and wait for 99.c to release ;) |