Wirehead Studios

http://steamcommunity.com/app/282440/workshop/

I'm not posting this to advertise Quake Live and have an ignorant unrealistic demand for "poort generation's to quake live this gona be huge", but rather one about vigilance and awareness that workshop is horrible when it comes to honor and respect for authors' rights.

and yes tabun's models popped up there, without permission no doubt.  I commented asking if he had permission, I got no answer and my comment deleted, so yeah....

Ahh, thanks for the heads up.  I don't follow Quake Live much personally, but discussion of anything Quake related or regarding Id's games in general is definitely welcome and encouraged here.
 :slippy_thumb:

Regarding the models... is this only regarding the two player models?  If so, those are OK for someone to post as long as they're unaltered and nobody's claiming them as being made by anyone other than Tabun.  If someone has posted any content from Generations other than the Qforcer and Strogg Guard, definitely let me know the links and I'll take care of the issue personally.

The thing is, with Quake Live, you have to alter the files to get them to work.  Scale and shaders need to be corrected, PNGs have to be made (rather than TGA which I prefer) though I don't know how this guy broke the sounds but he is definitely altering them.

This is really just the beginning of the workshop.  Eventually someone will have the "bright idea" to take Generations Arena stuff wholesale and up it to the workshop without authorization sooner or later...

I see.  I did not know alteration was required.  I'll let Tabun know about this and see what his take is. Thanks for the heads up.  :doom_thumb:

Holy shit, they didn't waste any time :wtf:

Double-post, won't let me edit for some reason.

As a test I tried loading up the Pi model in QL without any modifications and she works perfectly. No shader edits or .PNG conversions were needed. Looks like (at least locally) Q3 models load up in QL just fine.

Most custom models use unofficial plugins based on unofficial MD3 specs and the like so there'll be unforeseen problems like scale being off.


I've done a test export from Blender to Quake Live and it was way (http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/398926042182957965/41C477E3F281796A569E4DBA44E6249D52014C14/) too big (http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/398926042183166355/B62199C03B203644883D6E27C59796FB7CBDAB59/).  The new quake fandumb won't realize and will submit things that aren't theirs in the workshop anyway, like the coralctf with broken shaders


I also posted on ..::LvL about this issue. (http://lvlworld.com/thread/235/0)

Eww.  I can see how this is going to piss off a lot of mappers.  :surprise:

Interesting that your results were too big, because upon closer inspection I've noticed that the models I've been testing with (simply loading up the .pk3 in most cases) are actually a bit on the small side (Pi, Fritzkrieg, Reaper and Mistress, especially the last two). It's tricky to do a side-by-side comparison, given how vanilla Q3 handles models switching ingame, but there's definitely something, well, off.

For the record, I've been screwing around with these assets for my own amusement and had no intention of posting this stuff on the Workshop anyway. I'll admit that I don't know the first thing about 3D modelling, I really just wanted to expand the bot roster.

It's strange though that some shaders port forward into QL and some don't. About a year ago I tried my hand at porting QL's new Crash, James and Janet (Callisto) skins back into Q3. I managed it, but it was a pain in the arse, and they only work in Icculus.

So, all things considered, unless I get my arse in gear and learn Blender or 3DSMax, I suppose this (http://imgur.com/VIpqfHN) was a wasted effort :P

A thief submitted a nude Conni model to the workshop and it also appeared really small.  Shockingly though, it was removed.

So I guess only nudes are removed but copyright infractions are OK? That's not a good sign, workshop.

For player models... here's a general rule.  The player bounding box is 56 units high.  A standard Q3 model is going to be somewhere around that height.  Your units in your modeling program should have a 1:1 correspondence to the exported .md3.  The best way to test this is to import an existing model such as Doom or Ranger, and re-export, then test it side-by-side in the game (under a different name) with the original.  If there's a height difference then your import/export utility is fux0ring the units.  Whenever I do model work I always use an existing model as a reference as well.  It helps greatly with proportioning and placement... though I'm mainly dealing with weapon models, the same principles apply.

Scal, do you have a copy of the Q3 shader manual?  If not, it has every shader function Q3 uses for both maps and models.  I can provide a copy.  If a shader function is not in that it won't work in normal Q3.  If you have a particular shader that's not working I can explain what's going on with it.  I know the shader language inside and out. :doom_thumb:

Even if the MD3 looks all properly sized in Q3, QL will do something to it. Weapon scale also gets affected


I don't know if it parses the size of a tag_floor or anything, I have to investigate more.

I'm actually working on at least one player model for Quake Live while doing all the early steps through Q3 first.

I know shaders too and i've even added some cruft to my renderer fork like parsing them down to work with first generation 3d accelerators, and some additional hacked up tcGen environmentmaps :P

@Pko: I would like to at least get a basic understanding of Q3's shader language. My exploits with the QL skins had me basically going by texture names with regards to what was needed, and any entries which caused conflicts were simply deleted :P Amazingly, after about three hours of trial and error I managed to get them looking as they should, but I doubt I could replicate it.

Oh, and it had to happen (http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=546978238&searchtext=).

Funny there's comments calling that illegal when it's just a script of some sort

Small model issues don't stop oblivious people (http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=548242888).

Scal:  I uploaded the shader manual to the Wirehead site since the old Id Software link is broken now.  To keep this topic from going off track, I'm starting a new topic for shader discussion.

Yeah, I susbcribed to that mod just to see if they'd been corrected. Nope.

Funnily enough, I've actually managed to get hold of Pi and Fritz' official team skins from Quake Arena Arcade. Even got them working properly with my (extremely) limited shader knowledge.
(http://i.imgur.com/jSNpaIl.jpg)
I'm half-tempted to post them at this rate. Probably won't though :P

@Pho: Good stuff. I'll be giving that a perusal over the weekend.

Update on the Qforcer and Strogg Guard:  I got a reply back from Tabun.  The fellow that posted them did contact him for permission, and Tabby says (he thinks) that the sound issues have been fixed.  Either way it's not a violation of any kind, so it's good.  It's nice to see someone ask permission for a change!  :slippy_love:

Common sense prevails. Very much the exception rather than the rule.

Getting the hang of this:
(http://i.imgur.com/Fs35ct8.jpg)
The Q3 shader terminology is beginning to make sense in my head. I'm beginning to grasp the ins and outs of making objects glow. Well, it's a start :P

EDIT: I probably should have posted this over on the Shader discussion thread, but since I'm using ripped assets for practice I suppose it's relevant. I've started oon Fritz' sport skins and am now finding myself in more and more of a moral dilemma ...

While I do not intend to use this thread as a name 'n shame, I'm reminding that there still exist the sort of people who have the audacity to claim full credit for others' old work (https://www.reddit.com/r/QuakeLive/comments/3s78ob/new_workshop_model_my_retexture_of_cloud_strife/) and make up some bullshit about putting effort into it.

Well, I ended up posting those skins with a disclaimer. I'm not out to make a name for myself here, but on reflection it seemed a bit daft to spend 4 hours working on something only to sit on it. TBH if the original models hadn't already been posted, I wouldn't even have considered it.

Generations Arena Q2 Railgun stolen (http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=565034919&searchtext=)

That took longer than expected.

*sigh*  I've informed the individual that (s)he does not have our permission to do this and a DMCA notice has been sent to Valve to back it up.  I hate having to do this sort of thing.  Probably just wants to play using a cool railgun model and doesn't know anything about why this is the wrong way to go about it.   :(

The page is no longer there, so either the individual in question removed it, or Valve removed it.  Hopefully the individual in question will learn from this and not get in trouble with the larger studios in the future.

To said person... if you're reading this thread on our forums, please understand that we do not discourage modding.  We're Quake enthusiasts just like you, but we've worked very hard on our project and are still working hard on it.  We may, in the future, allow our models to be used outside our mod on a case-by-case basis.  We only want to release our own content with our project first.  Professional game companies and publishers don't always ask nicely when someone uses their stuff without understanding how copyright and intellectual property works.  Please understand - some of them will sue first and ask questions later.  That's not our goal.  We're not out to "get" anyone here.  We just ask that people give us the recognition that our hard work does belong to us and to ask permission before doing something with it that we may not be ready to have done.

If you're interested in modding, by all means, talk to us!  Register on our forums and ask questions.  We're always willing to help fledgeling modders along to making their own unique content that they can be proud of, and to demystify copyright and intellectual property law and fair usage rights so that nobody makes the kind of mistakes that were made with Generations for Quake 2 that resulted in that project being shut down.  We don't want to see anyone's hard work get lost like that, so if you want to learn the difference between the wrong way and the right way of modding, please don't hate on us, but let us guide you in the right direction instead.

There was also a thread on the Quake Live discussion talking about just this sort of thing.  Some people are confused as to what is and is not OK, so I posted a blurb and subscribed to the discussion.  Hopefully I can help save some people some headaches down the road.  Thanks again, leilei!  :doom_thumb:

Stolen Gen stuff that takes me back