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Makou
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QL forum thread with changelist here. It kind of speaks for itself. RIP Quake Live |
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If you see a "Rona Altana" out there on the internet somewhere, that's probably me
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MadTux
Ogre
Posts: 54
*Personal* text? No way!
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No!  I don't even play QL (I'm quite happy with Q3A, thank you very much), but yes, RIP QL. Those changes are to make it newbie-fwiendly? As a newb, I officially say that SUCKS.  |
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Oooh look -- a signature!
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Woodsman
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I just played a few rounds and i really have no idea what you guys are crying about.
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Phoenix
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I never really got into Quake Live since it's basically Q3A with ads, and I don't care much for Q3A out of the box. Looking at that list of changes and explanations it seems like they've turned Quake Live into the equivalent of a mod instead of trying to be anywhere faithful to out-of-the-box Q3.
This is one area where I've kind of developed a bit of a concern with constant patches and updates on games. I understand the need for bug fixes, and sometimes adding features is a good thing, but with older games you pretty much had a certain expectation of how the game would play, and that was fairly constant with the exception of mods. Quake 2 is the same now as it was 10 years ago. The most obvious example I can think of for a game that's changed completely from what it was is Team Fortress 2. Fresh installed out of the Orange Box, TF2 barely resembles the game it is today one bit. Some players love it, others - like myself, do not, for various reasons. I won't rant about the specifics as that will take me off track... my point is that you pay for one game that down the road may end up completely different, for good or for ill. Quake Live has taken that track, and it does affect the player base. Players that love the game "as it was" will leave, while other players may welcome the changes, and new players will have no concept of old vs new.
I think the biggest problem I have with online games that continually evolve beyond being in a "completed" state, but change features over time due to player feedback or what have you is that there's almost never an option to play the game "as it was". Team Fortress 2 is like this... I imagine Quake Live will is also following that pattern. It's something we've tried to avoid with Generations as far as the Arena Gladiators are concerned. We've made a few changes - spawn ammo with the machinegun, spawn health, and the Q3 BFG - but beyond that the class is mainly untouched, and you can still enable the "out of the box" Q3 BFG with a server cvar. The spawn ammo and spawn health will be probably get cvared as well. I wish more devs would keep the old-school nostalgia players in mind when they make these kinds of changes and allow for older-style play. I've heard the usual arguments against this, and its always from new players about how it will "split the player base" and be detrimental, but the fault with that logic is in that the player base is already split when these kinds of changes are introduced, and the old-school players decide often to leave the game, as I did with Team Fortress 2. It's an unhappy situation that leaves a good number of players out in the cold, and it's a trend I'd like to see changed.
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  I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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FistMarine
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I don't have words for this...I mean all these changes, seriously? I'm quite surprised at this, I remember playing QL a couple of years ago (I believe I first tried it out in 2010 when it was still in beta) and it was OK, I quite liked it. But I remember it was really buggy sometime later in mid/late 2010, which includes those ads that randomly crashed game for no reason but other thing that bugged me was that settings would not get saved (well, at least not all settings), I mean crosshair and FOV were still the default settings and so on. I also didn't like the fact that blood was censored and a couple other changes such as weapons dealing less damage than usual. Plus now it's coming to Steam! I hate steam!  R.I.P Quake Live  Also can someone show me how does that new weapon Heavy Machinegun looks alike? I looked on QL Game Manual but it's not described here.  |
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« Last Edit: 2014-08-30, 07:37 by FistMarine »
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Woodsman
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the heavy machine gun is actually pretty cool
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Phoenix
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I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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Woodsman
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I actually like Quake live, I don't play it very much since having a wife and kids makes the amount of play required to stay competitive near impossible. I was afraid that the fan base might have changed since my day, (feel old?) but i haven't noticed any irritating call of duty style smack talking or chatter. There are some nice new maps and its just gratifying to find a server with people playing, my legit Q3 cd keys ( of 3 copies i owned) was compromised before i was old enough to vote ( yes aging sucks ) and that kept me from playing much quake3 online so this was a good deal for me. ( so all you who said i was too chicken to play generations online, blow me ). As for the new features presumably duming down the game to make it easier for "newbs" (always hated that term) let me just put it this way, many of us on this forum have been playing this game literally longer than some of the new gamers have been alive. Now you feel old!
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MadTux
Ogre
Posts: 54
*Personal* text? No way!
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( so all you who said i was too chicken to play generations online, blow me ). I'm not sure if I fall into that category, but I always did wonder why you never played Gen online. Why you not just say you lost your keys?If you did buy the game, wouldn't it be perfectly OK to use that 'hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh' key? |
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Oooh look -- a signature!
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Phoenix
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I don't see why not. You can also just edit q3config.cfg and add this line and it won't ask:
seta ui_cdkeychecked "1"
I had serious problems with Id's CD key checking returning "Invalid CD KEY/Missing CD Key?" back during the .99a/.99b phase of Gen when I have 3 valid Q3 CD keys - one from normal retail Q3, one from Q3 Gold which has Team Arena, and one from Linux Q3. I'd get that message despite never having shared my keys with anyone. I wasn't the only one with this problem either. The only servers that check for cd key stuff have sv_strictauth set to "1", so the solution to this was to set use rcon to set Gen's servers to sv_strictauth "0", so that they don't bother checking with Id's master to see if someone's CD key is valid or not. I was able to play fine after that, and so was everyone else.
I think the only thing that might provide a headache on a normal Q3A server with CD key stuff is Punkbuster, but Gen doesn't use Punkbuster and I haven't touched a normal Q3 server in years. Still, it means Woods can play Gen if he wants so long as he has can install Q3. 
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I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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Thomas Mink
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Oddly, I fell into a different category. My CD Key ALWAYS worked... I even gave it to about half of my old clan when we moved to Q3F and everyone was able to play using it. Not sure if Q3F changed something in regard to the key or whatever, but I'll never forget that. ( so all you who said i was too chicken to play generations online, blow me )
Can't say I thought you were chicken.. but I DID find it odd you never joined in any forum games, or release parties before that. |
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Woodsman
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I didn't lose my keys, but at repeated lan partys over the years the internet got the idea that they belonged to someone else and suddenly they wouldn't let me play online anymore. After awhile i just kinda quit trying.
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Woodsman
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But while i never played any forum games i did play Gen at Lan parties with Leemon and Kenny and a number of other forum regulars. I also played at Quakecon when ever i could. I played bot matches all the time. I've been a Gen Player since 99A. Hell i even played Quake 2 gen.
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Phoenix
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So you had the same thing happen to you that I did regarding the CD Key issue. That sucks!
Glad to know you got to enjoy some LAN fragging, though! 
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I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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Kain-Xavier
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Isn't Team Arena's chaingun a "heavy" machinegun? I don't understand that addition.
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FistMarine
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Thanks! I don't see why not. You can also just edit q3config.cfg and add this line and it won't ask:
seta ui_cdkeychecked "1"
I had serious problems with Id's CD key checking returning "Invalid CD KEY/Missing CD Key?" back during the .99a/.99b phase of Gen when I have 3 valid Q3 CD keys - one from normal retail Q3, one from Q3 Gold which has Team Arena, and one from Linux Q3. I'd get that message despite never having shared my keys with anyone. I wasn't the only one with this problem either. The only servers that check for cd key stuff have sv_strictauth set to "1", so the solution to this was to set use rcon to set Gen's servers to sv_strictauth "0", so that they don't bother checking with Id's master to see if someone's CD key is valid or not. I was able to play fine after that, and so was everyone else.
I think the only thing that might provide a headache on a normal Q3A server with CD key stuff is Punkbuster, but Gen doesn't use Punkbuster and I haven't touched a normal Q3 server in years. Still, it means Woods can play Gen if he wants so long as he has can install Q3. Back then I admit I didn't have original copies of Quake 1 and 3 (I had pirate copies, I had Q1 from an unofficial compilation CD called 3D Action Games Collection, which had full version of Quake 1 but also had Full Duke3D and other games on it, while Quake 3 I got from a friend of father and later I lost that copy, then got another one, again from another friend of father and later when I lost again, I downloaded from a torrent site).
The first Quake 3 pirated versions I had (around 2004-2009) were without music and without cinematics (the only cinematics that were included in pirated version were ID LOGO and the final cutscene when you defeat Xaero, the TIER cinematics were missing for some reason). I had original copies of Quake 2 and Quake 4 from start (got Quake 2 in 2004, Quake 4 I got in 2006) which I got as birthday presents. I must say I was lucky that I had all Quake games full versions from start, I only played demo versions AFTER completing full versions to compare stuff. Though I didn't play any expansion packs, with exception of Team Arena Demo (the funny thing is that I discovered and downloaded Team Arena Demo right on my 11th birthday, along with Quake 4 I got a day before) and later I also got full Team Arena (again downloaded from internet) in 2008.
2 years ago, I started buying from eBay and first thing I bought was Quake 3 Arena DVD copy. Later I also got Quake 1 CD copy, then the mission packs and then compilations such as Quake 3 Gold Edition, Quake 4 Special Edition and Ultimate Quake. My Quake Collection as of present: http://i60.tinypic.com/fxfk1f.jpg -> CDs http://i57.tinypic.com/2wecnic.jpg -> DVDs |
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~Va^^pyrA~
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So... Quake Live... Yeeeeeeeah.  I had an account from a couple of years back (2010?). I never played much, but had tried it out originally nonetheless. The lack of custom content really hurt the long term appeal for me at the time. Anyway, I went ahead and linked it with my Steam account the other day. I have to say, the game does look nice. From what I can tell, most of that is updated particle effects and bloom, though. Furthermore, all of the social features and stat tracking are fun, even if I wish they had ported it all right into Steam. The downside? It's gimped beyond belief! <rant> I don't so much mind the item timers, even if they do feel unnecessary. The weapon loadout is embarrassing though. It make the game feel as if the goal is to quickly spawn, try to kill one or two people with your weapon, and then do it all over again. There is no build up, collecting weapons and ammo, no reason to run the map or control areas. It also gives newly spawned players fairly cheap kills, as they can pop right in with a railgun. I'm not sure what to think of the Heavy Machinegun, either. It's almost like a cross between the original MG and the TA Chaingun. It's clearly designed to give Call of Duty fans something familiar to run around with. It doesn't really feel as if it feels any particular niche in the game, though. It also looks a little out of place, I think. It also appears as if all of the weapon specific ammo pickups have been replaced with generic "ammo crates" that give you a little bit of ammo for everything? This only further diminishes the need to run the map and control areas. And that new announcer... he kind of sounds like Duke Nukem, lol. I get that they needed to record new lines and wanted it all to be cohesive. Still, if it was going to sound that bad, I would have preferred something completely different from the original voice. For example, I like the computerized female voice that we have in Generations quite a bit.  Oh... and having to PAY to create a match for friends? Insane!  </rant> I really wish that we could have seem a proper Steam release of an updated Quake3. It feels as if the Quake Arena Arcade title for Xbox was more in line with what I would have wanted out of a base product. Integrate that into Steamworks and you might just have something. |
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Phoenix
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Well... one thing I can guarantee. None of what's in your spoiler-tagged section will ever make it into Gen. That's the beauty of making a nostalgia mod that tries to stay true to the originals: It's kind of hard to spork up what was already great in the first place. 
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I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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~Va^^pyrA~
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Aye! It's probably the reason I always have Gen installed and ready to go. Though if I had my wish, there are a few things I'd change in base Q3A. I'm not a complete purist.  |
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« Last Edit: 2014-09-24, 00:40 by ~Va^^pyrA~ »
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