http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/06/13/e3-2016-bethesda-reveals-quake-champions


It's fun to see Wrack and Visor fully rendered in the trailer, but the rest is a big question mark. Many suggest, based on the "warrios with unique attributes" and "fun for every skill level" bits, that Bethesda is trying to capitalize on the current trend of hero-based shooters like Overwatch. We certainly know from Doom 4 that Bethesda will not greenlight an Id title without some sort of big marketing gimmick to make it a crowd-pleaser.

If you follow through all the stupid pages in that article, it's speculated that Wrack's purple ball is basically a translocator mechanic complete with telefrag capability. Meanwhile, Visor allegedly has a wallhack similar to Widowmaker from Overwatch (oh god...)

It's really too early to judge. I don't mind the idea of hero abilities, and it could work for Quake, especially if you are still picking up weapons off the map. Hopefully Bethesda has gotten the message by now from Doom 4's lackluster reception that no one cares to see loadouts in Id games. This could also wind up being a lot like Unreal Championship 2, which almost worked for Unreal (though it still had serious flaws).

But yeah...to be safe, I am just going to assume it's going to be a more Quake-like version of Law Breakers, and then it can't really disapoint me.

Yeah, I agree that a Q1 reboot would have been interesting. At least we got an HD Wrack, even if he is so overmuscled he looks like a rejected design for GOW.

Yeah, but "Arena Champions" doesn't have quite the same ring to it.

I too was hoping for a return to the series' roots, but if it actually retains what made Q3 so ace in the first place (eg no loadouts for a kickoff), I can live with the character attributes and such.

Good to see Wrack and Visor and I'm assuming the hot babe with the blue hair is Mynx. Like Gnam says, if they learn from DOOM's MP missteps (no FFA?? Seriously??) and go flat out arena shooter, it could be awesome. After DOOM's SP campaign, I have to say I'm more optimistic than I've been about an id game since Quake 4 left me with a salty taste in my mouth*.

*For the record, I thoroughly enjoyed Q4, it just wasn't really a Quake game.

I'm open to champions.  Who knows, it might play like Generations

So much "rip quake" around the internet, when the game really died in 2000 when Counter-Strike came out and when they figured out "oh its open source let's make our pro qw cheats legal new way The way to quake is us now huhuhu......why are there no players!!!! *posts warez repack as a free game* "

also it's not CPMA of course, and it's still just a reveal/announcement and game design is still subject to change.  After all, Q3A once had (weight) classes, and every time I bring that up, quake fans think i'm pulling that out of my ass, or "correct" me towards Q3TA's runes


FTR I wasn't anticipating a "Quake sequel" or anything like that (not even from the job "leak")because that would be a bit of a brand clash with their own The Evil Within and Doom properties (especially when Quake was originally an ambitious rpg that turned into a slapdash doom).  Every Quake in the series is a radical departure from the last anyway, and ironically the one that's a real sequel is the black sheep of the series.

Hey.. I'm still not sure if I even accept Q2 as a 'Quake' title, let alone Q3. So my earlier comment is nothing new for me.

Quake has been dead since '96 from my standpoint.. even though I didn't stop playing (QWTF) until around '99 or 2000.. whenever it was that my clan decided to try a jump into Q3F.

Thing is, Q3 always struck me as the FPS equivalent of something like Marvel vs Capcom, or more specifically the mor recent SF games, ie a large roster of characters including a decent contingent of guest fighters from other franchises all brought together to duke it out in an ultimate showdown. Champions seems to be an extension of that, giving each character their own unique way of fighting, just like the beat-em-ups we've had for almost 30 years now. That's what Overwatch, Battleborn and QC are, Street Fighter II with guns!

I can comment on that a bit since my girlfriend was anticipating Overwatch and got me to play with her starting with the open beta in May...

Overwatch does have some similarities to Quake since it's heavily based on Team Fortress. However, being by Blizzard, it's also aggressively casual-friendly to the point that I don't think many Gen Arena players would like it. In general, easy stuff like hitscan spray weapons and character ability gimmicks take precedence in damage over skill-based projectiles like rockets and grenades.

Hitscan does have a damage fall-off over distance property, but it's more appropriate to think of it as a "close range damage buff" property, because despite dealing a proper 50-70 DPS at long range, they fly off the handle to 170 or more at close range. So basically across average combat distances, projectiles don't have the raw power to make up for their slow travel time, and you have to hug character gimmicks like jet packs and energy barriers VERY HARD to stand any chance.

The game also has really lackluster movement. If you think UT is too slow compared to Quake, then hold on to your seats, because Overwatch is a whole new kind of slow. There are a few characters with a jetpack, teleport, wallrun, or mine jump, but they're really not enough to make the game feel-paced or like movement is heavily skill-based. Even just the basic game of zigzagging, bobbing, and weaving in place to avoid enemy fire is very weak compared to just about ANY other arena shooter.

I say all this because it's the worst case scenario for Quake Champions' promise of "fun for all levels of players". It's entirely too early to judge QC's gameplay, but if Bethesda goes full-on casual with it, Overwatch is what it could be like.

In terms of popularity, there is some potential there. Overwatch's fanbase is largely non-FPS players who finally have a shooter that caters to their lack of twitch aiming skills. However, there are also some arena shooter fans like me playing it simply because it's a new arena shooter with a large playerbase fit to blow off steam casually after work.

In fact, I happened to be on the official Overwatch forums when Quake Champions was announced. Normally the OW forums are full of threads demanding nerfs to the "overpowered" flavor of the week character, but the Quake Champions thread stayed near the top for a good portion of the day as Quake fans crawled out of the woodwork to comment about how they were excited to play a game with more skill-based hardcore mechanics.

However, if Bethesda really wants to edge in on Overwatch's turf with Quake Champions, they have a huge hurdle to cross with marketting and character design. Overwatch has gained a huge audience specifically because it eschews the testosterone-fueled violent aesthetic which has become a cliche in FPS. The trailer Betheda released earlier this week is the exact opposite of the vibe that has won Overwatch so many fans.

That's not to say that Quake has to entirely reinvent itself with no violence at all, but parading meathead overmuscled GOW-esque character designs is not going to win Quake Champions any fans. Generic blue-haired, leather-clad cyberpunk heroines will not work either. Bethesda is really going to have to reach hard to come up with character designs that are fearsome but also sophisticated in order to win over a modern audience. Generic beefcake space marines are not at all in fashion anymore.

Doom 4 may have been successful despite this, but think back to all the bad PR over the official cover, which was a shot of JUST the marine without even any of the demons that made the franchise. THAT is what Quake Champsions has to face if they don't step up their marketing.

Chiming in on the Overwatch bit, I would definitely agree that it lacks the frenetic pace of a proper deathmatch. As for skill.. It fits Blizzard's trademark "Easy to play, difficult to master" mold fairly well. I used to hate playing Junkrat and Tracer early on, but now that I have a proper feel for the mechanics, the only character I hate is Hanzo because his friggin arrows have a hitbox the size of a Mack truck.. Also the "shooter-based-hit-detection" can be frustrating in the extreme. Can't tell you how many times I've taken damage from behind a wall because some high ping player lobbed an arrow in my general direction some 3-400 msecs ago. Slowing down the game helps even out the netcode issues, and forces players into teamwork situations. I enjoy the latter when it works, and dislike it when it doesn't.

They're talking about taking this direction with Quake, and while I don't mind gimmicks when balanced, I'm a bit concerned about the netcode. I'm cautiously optimistic after Doom's single player. But the multiplayer makes me concerned that Quake is going to feel more like Gears of War.. I suppose we'll see..

TBH I can't see progression unlocks being completely absent, but the game could get away with them if they were cosmetic only. In fact, I'd be all over that. I love custom models/skins for Q3/QL, but it sucks when I know that other people on the server can't see them. Such a system would negate that (and let's be honest, mod support ain't on the cards), allowing at least a degree of player individuality, something we've come to expect in online multiplayer in recent years.

All things considered, show me some gameplay media and I can get properly hyped.

So much this.
But I'll be honest.. if it's cosmetic, I feel that should be an option anyway.

Keeping with TF2: as soon as hats were first released, I was part of a very small group of people asking for an option to turn them off. We got called 'jealous' and 'hatless bums', despite the fact I had earned a few.. just chose to outright delete them instead of trade or wear them.
A popular response was also 'don't use them then'.. but what good is that if you can see it on everyone else?
I stopped playing entirely a little after that because it went from tolerably annoying to just plain bad as more updates came out.