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Author Topic: Quake Live has a workshop  (Read 3048 times)
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leilei
 

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« on: 2015-10-30, 23:49 »

http://steamcommunity.com/app/282440/workshop/

I'm not posting this to advertise Quake Live and have an ignorant unrealistic demand for "poort generation's to quake live this gona be huge", but rather one about vigilance and awareness that workshop is horrible when it comes to honor and respect for authors' rights.

and yes tabun's models popped up there, without permission no doubt.  I commented asking if he had permission, I got no answer and my comment deleted, so yeah....
« Last Edit: 2015-10-31, 01:01 by leilei » Logged

Phoenix
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« Reply #1 on: 2015-10-31, 02:44 »

Ahh, thanks for the heads up.  I don't follow Quake Live much personally, but discussion of anything Quake related or regarding Id's games in general is definitely welcome and encouraged here.
 Slipgate - Thumbs up!

Regarding the models... is this only regarding the two player models?  If so, those are OK for someone to post as long as they're unaltered and nobody's claiming them as being made by anyone other than Tabun.  If someone has posted any content from Generations other than the Qforcer and Strogg Guard, definitely let me know the links and I'll take care of the issue personally.
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leilei
 

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« Reply #2 on: 2015-10-31, 11:52 »

The thing is, with Quake Live, you have to alter the files to get them to work.  Scale and shaders need to be corrected, PNGs have to be made (rather than TGA which I prefer) though I don't know how this guy broke the sounds but he is definitely altering them.

This is really just the beginning of the workshop.  Eventually someone will have the "bright idea" to take Generations Arena stuff wholesale and up it to the workshop without authorization sooner or later...
« Last Edit: 2015-10-31, 11:55 by leilei » Logged

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« Reply #3 on: 2015-10-31, 20:02 »

I see.  I did not know alteration was required.  I'll let Tabun know about this and see what his take is. Thanks for the heads up.  Doom - Thumbs Up!
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scalliano
 

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« Reply #4 on: 2015-11-01, 02:29 »

Holy shit, they didn't waste any time Slipgate - WTF
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scalliano
 

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« Reply #5 on: 2015-11-02, 02:04 »

Double-post, won't let me edit for some reason.

As a test I tried loading up the Pi model in QL without any modifications and she works perfectly. No shader edits or .PNG conversions were needed. Looks like (at least locally) Q3 models load up in QL just fine.
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leilei
 

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« Reply #6 on: 2015-11-02, 02:52 »

Most custom models use unofficial plugins based on unofficial MD3 specs and the like so there'll be unforeseen problems like scale being off.


I've done a test export from Blender to Quake Live and it was way too big.  The new quake fandumb won't realize and will submit things that aren't theirs in the workshop anyway, like the coralctf with broken shaders


I also posted on ..::LvL about this issue.
« Last Edit: 2015-11-02, 03:05 by leilei » Logged

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« Reply #7 on: 2015-11-02, 19:27 »

Eww.  I can see how this is going to piss off a lot of mappers.  Slipgate - Surprised
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scalliano
 

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« Reply #8 on: 2015-11-03, 00:56 »

Most custom models use unofficial plugins based on unofficial MD3 specs and the like so there'll be unforeseen problems like scale being off.


I've done a test export from Blender to Quake Live and it was way too big.  The new quake fandumb won't realize and will submit things that aren't theirs in the workshop anyway, like the coralctf with broken shaders


I also posted on ..::LvL about this issue.

Interesting that your results were too big, because upon closer inspection I've noticed that the models I've been testing with (simply loading up the .pk3 in most cases) are actually a bit on the small side (Pi, Fritzkrieg, Reaper and Mistress, especially the last two). It's tricky to do a side-by-side comparison, given how vanilla Q3 handles models switching ingame, but there's definitely something, well, off.

For the record, I've been screwing around with these assets for my own amusement and had no intention of posting this stuff on the Workshop anyway. I'll admit that I don't know the first thing about 3D modelling, I really just wanted to expand the bot roster.

It's strange though that some shaders port forward into QL and some don't. About a year ago I tried my hand at porting QL's new Crash, James and Janet (Callisto) skins back into Q3. I managed it, but it was a pain in the arse, and they only work in Icculus.

So, all things considered, unless I get my arse in gear and learn Blender or 3DSMax, I suppose this was a wasted effort Slipgate - Tongue
« Last Edit: 2015-11-03, 01:27 by scalliano » Logged

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leilei
 

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« Reply #9 on: 2015-11-03, 02:44 »

A thief submitted a nude Conni model to the workshop and it also appeared really small.  Shockingly though, it was removed.

So I guess only nudes are removed but copyright infractions are OK? That's not a good sign, workshop.
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« Reply #10 on: 2015-11-03, 21:21 »

For player models... here's a general rule.  The player bounding box is 56 units high.  A standard Q3 model is going to be somewhere around that height.  Your units in your modeling program should have a 1:1 correspondence to the exported .md3.  The best way to test this is to import an existing model such as Doom or Ranger, and re-export, then test it side-by-side in the game (under a different name) with the original.  If there's a height difference then your import/export utility is fux0ring the units.  Whenever I do model work I always use an existing model as a reference as well.  It helps greatly with proportioning and placement... though I'm mainly dealing with weapon models, the same principles apply.

Scal, do you have a copy of the Q3 shader manual?  If not, it has every shader function Q3 uses for both maps and models.  I can provide a copy.  If a shader function is not in that it won't work in normal Q3.  If you have a particular shader that's not working I can explain what's going on with it.  I know the shader language inside and out. Doom - Thumbs Up!
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« Reply #11 on: 2015-11-03, 23:31 »

Even if the MD3 looks all properly sized in Q3, QL will do something to it. Weapon scale also gets affected


I don't know if it parses the size of a tag_floor or anything, I have to investigate more.

I'm actually working on at least one player model for Quake Live while doing all the early steps through Q3 first.

I know shaders too and i've even added some cruft to my renderer fork like parsing them down to work with first generation 3d accelerators, and some additional hacked up tcGen environmentmaps Slipgate - Tongue
« Last Edit: 2015-11-03, 23:33 by leilei » Logged

scalliano
 

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« Reply #12 on: 2015-11-04, 01:24 »

@Pko: I would like to at least get a basic understanding of Q3's shader language. My exploits with the QL skins had me basically going by texture names with regards to what was needed, and any entries which caused conflicts were simply deleted Slipgate - Tongue Amazingly, after about three hours of trial and error I managed to get them looking as they should, but I doubt I could replicate it.

Oh, and it had to happen.
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leilei
 

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« Reply #13 on: 2015-11-04, 01:27 »

Funny there's comments calling that illegal when it's just a script of some sort

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leilei
 

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« Reply #14 on: 2015-11-05, 02:32 »

Small model issues don't stop oblivious people.
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« Reply #15 on: 2015-11-05, 22:28 »

Scal:  I uploaded the shader manual to the Wirehead site since the old Id Software link is broken now.  To keep this topic from going off track, I'm starting a new topic for shader discussion.
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scalliano
 

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« Reply #16 on: 2015-11-06, 19:21 »

Small model issues don't stop oblivious people.


Yeah, I susbcribed to that mod just to see if they'd been corrected. Nope.

Funnily enough, I've actually managed to get hold of Pi and Fritz' official team skins from Quake Arena Arcade. Even got them working properly with my (extremely) limited shader knowledge.

I'm half-tempted to post them at this rate. Probably won't though Slipgate - Tongue

@Pho: Good stuff. I'll be giving that a perusal over the weekend.
« Last Edit: 2015-11-06, 19:37 by scalliano » Logged

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« Reply #17 on: 2015-11-10, 00:03 »

Update on the Qforcer and Strogg Guard:  I got a reply back from Tabun.  The fellow that posted them did contact him for permission, and Tabby says (he thinks) that the sound issues have been fixed.  Either way it's not a violation of any kind, so it's good.  It's nice to see someone ask permission for a change!  Slipgate - Love
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« Reply #18 on: 2015-11-10, 01:53 »

Common sense prevails. Very much the exception rather than the rule.
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« Reply #19 on: 2015-11-13, 00:14 »

Getting the hang of this:

The Q3 shader terminology is beginning to make sense in my head. I'm beginning to grasp the ins and outs of making objects glow. Well, it's a start Slipgate - Tongue

EDIT: I probably should have posted this over on the Shader discussion thread, but since I'm using ripped assets for practice I suppose it's relevant. I've started oon Fritz' sport skins and am now finding myself in more and more of a moral dilemma ...
« Last Edit: 2015-11-13, 00:37 by scalliano » Logged

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