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Phoenix
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This is when the "fun" begins. Something has to be causing the problem. Upping the available power was still a good idea as you were definitely under spec, but if that didn't fix the problem, something else must be the culprit. Let's run down the list.
You may want to clear the CMOS data and take the BIOS settings back to factory. If there's one thing set wrong, like a voltage level, or a bus timing, that can cause instability. I know you checked stuff, but sometimes it's easy to miss. The CMOS data can get garbled from time to time as well, which clearing it will fix. I've had this happen on older machines, especially when the CMOS battery starts getting weak. If you do go to clear the CMOS data, make sure you jot down all the old settings first. There's also the possibility of a BIOS flash needing to be done to fully support the CPU. Not having a floppy disk makes that process a lot harder, because usually BIOS flash software wants to be loaded from a DOS boot disk.
If you can't test the memory with software, there's another way to do it. If you have more than one RAM module, try running it on one module by itself, then the other. See if anything changes. If it behaves good with one module, but not the other, try putting the one it misbehaves with in a different slot, booting it with just that module, and see if it still happens. If it does, the chip is bad. If it doesn't, test the "good" RAM module in the slot the "bad" one is. If it malfunctions, you know the slot is bad. If not, sometimes pairing them in different slots fixes instability. Some of my old computers only ran if the RAM modules were paired in specific slots. Reverse them, and it wouldn't even boot. If you only have one RAM module, try moving it to a different slot and seeing if it helps at all.
If that doesn't work, try removing the sound card. If you're using onboard sound, disable it in the BIOS. Run the machine. See if the problem goes away.
If that doesn't work, try disconnecting anything else that is "non-essential". CD-ROM drives, modems, ethernet cards, anything that is not required to test this problem. See what happens.
I'm hoping you didn't get a defective CPU, or suffer an electrostatic discharge when installing it (you DID use a grounding strap, didn't you?). If power is good, and removing components does not help, that leaves only the mainboard or CPU as the culprit. I know you'll hate doing this, but try swapping the CPU back out. If the problem goes away, you either have a defective CPU or the mainboard is not fully supporting it for some reason, in which case I would suspect the BIOS revision. I've seen situations where components "just don't get alone", or a mainboard that runs good with one part won't run at all with another.
Do yourself a favor and invest in a floppy drive as well. I know they seem obsolete, and people have this urge to "do away with them for good", but they're cheap (only $6.00 US for a Mitsumi 3.5", $8.00 for a black one) and they can be an ass saver for certain things.
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  I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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scalliano
Elite
Posts: 1095
Yup, that's me
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Well, after a bit of BIOS fiddling I got my floppy drive up and running again. I haven't ran Memtest fully yet (I'll do that at bedtime). I did earth myself before putting the new CPU in, but because of the position of the socket getting the old fan off and the new fan on took over an hour each way, so I'm not ruling that out.
My BIOS has 2 options: Load Optimised Defaults and Load Fail-Safe Defaults. I'm not sure which is the factory setting. I haven't tried disabling the onboard sound yet, so that's worth a go.
I did actually try removing the CD-ROM drives last week, but Windows Product Activation had other ideas, so I couldn't test it out (any time I make a hardware change WPA will ALWAYS generate an invalid code for some reason, so a reinstallation is needed which requires the CD drive. Rock and a hard place, eh?).
I'll give the RAM swapping a go, as I'm willing to try anything that has any possibility of sorting this out.
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PSN ID: scalliano
The Arena knows no gender, colour or creed, only skill.
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games keeper
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Whoever dreamed that up should suffer a slow and painful death, followed by eternal torment in the lowest depth of hell. It was woodsman . |
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« Last Edit: 2005-08-14, 19:56 by games keeper »
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Moshman
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I had a similar experience with this yesterday. I spent all most all day fixing my box. I booted my computer and it said "failed memory test". I thought that was weird, and it did not boot, no screen no nothing. So I got inside my computer, and tried to re-feed my RAM, I switched my two gig sticks around the available slots. Then the computer finally booted, so I took the opportunity, to reset my CMOS, and then it booted from the OS.
However, then it under clocked my CPU, down to 1.15 GHz! From a 2800+ processor! So that was a bitch to fix. I went back in my BIOS, and reset my defined settings that were originally there. Then it did the "failed memory test" thing again. So I did the same thing as last time, went into the BIOS and farted around in there for a bit. I eventually narrowed down the problem to the CPU over clock, I thought, that was weird because how could it fail a memory test, if it just doesn't like the over clock? So I originally had the CPU frequency set to 200 MHz at a multiplier of 8.5. So I tried a frequency of 166 MHz at a multiplier of 11.5. Then everything was happy hunky dory. I don?t know if this will help you any but it's worth it to post. It may very well be your RAM.
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« Last Edit: 2005-08-14, 20:02 by Little Washu »
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scalliano
Elite
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Yup, that's me
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Right, progress report:
Below is a table of combinations of RAM that I've tried so far and their various effects. My motherboard has 3 slots, and I have 3 RAM chips in total: 2x256MB (A & B) and 1x128MB (the faulty one, C). All were tested using the GTA Liberty City mod for Vice City as it is the most consistent and always reboots within 10 minutes.
COMB Slot 1 Slot 2 Slot 3
1 A B C
2 A B -
3 B A -
4 - A -
5 - B -
6 - B A
7 B - A
8 B C A
9 B - -
RESULTS:
1. My original setup, before the CRC errors started.
2. The fail-safe setup, fine up until I installed the new CPU.
3. The PC still reboots with this setup.
4. Ran OK with no restarts, even after 3 hours of solid play.
5. Ran OK too, but I only tested it for about an hour.
6. Started rebooting again.
7. Same with this setup.
8. Held firm during gaming (usual memory glitches aside), but when I started up my PC again later on it rebooted the first time I ran Internet Explorer. This is the first non-game reboot I've had.
9. Ran fine for over 2 hours.
I choose my words very carefully here as my PC has a habit of making an arse out of me as soon as I form anything even remotely resembling a conclusion. I haven't tried every possible permutation yet, but from what I've gathered so far the problem seems to involve having more than one RAM chip installed. Realistically, though, I'm none the wiser as to what the actuall cause is.
I sincerely hope it isn't anything to do with my BIOS. Right now I don't have the ?25-or-so to reflash it. Nor do I have a credit card to buy it even if I did have the cash.
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PSN ID: scalliano
The Arena knows no gender, colour or creed, only skill.
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Moshman
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It seems that "slot 3" is this main thing that is giving you a hard time. Motherboards are nortorious for having bad RAM slots. If you still have a warranty for that motherboard, I'd take the opportunity to get it replaced.
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« Last Edit: 2005-08-16, 18:46 by Little Washu »
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scalliano
Elite
Posts: 1095
Yup, that's me
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Well, it's true that RAM chips can be temperamental buggers, and I THINK I've sussed out the problem. It isn't slot 3 per se, it would seem that chips A and B (my two 256MB ones) are conflicting. When I use either one, the system seems to run fine, and if I use either one in conjunction with my dodgy 128MB chip, there are still no restarts (apart from the odd BSoD but that's irrelevant), but whenever I run both together the system automatically throws up the proverbial rope.
I can't really be arsed using the dodgy chip as it has an adverse effect on eveything I do (downloads, gaming, not to mention those bloody CRC errors), so as it stands, I'm down to 256MB RAM in slot 3 for the interim. The only game I can't run properly at the moment is Doom 3, which I can live with for a few weeks until I get new RAM.
God, I hate computers ...
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PSN ID: scalliano
The Arena knows no gender, colour or creed, only skill.
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Phoenix
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Nice work on the testing, we're getting somewhere now. I've seen this kind of RAM conflict before, it's very common with older SDRAM DIMM modules. DDR doesn't seem to suffer from this problem as much, but it does happen. Some suggestions:
1) Check your BIOS information for your "bank interleave" settings. Make sure you don't have anything unusual or aggressive set. Usually leaving it to "auto" is best.
2) Check your BIOS information for your CAS Latency timings for the RAM chips. You could try relaxing the CAS timings on the modules. Typically higher numbers are slower. Example: 2-5-5-6, 2T could be changed to 2.5 6 6 8, 1T. These are examples, I don't know actual CAS timings since they're specific to your RAM chips, so go by what's available in your BIOS. The "By SPD" option reads the timing off the chip, and usually that's default setting, but if the chips are timed differently that could be causing your problems and the BIOS doesn't always display the SPD-dictated timings. Check the timings for each individual bank, and set them as slow as possible, setting both banks the same, and test that out. If that makes it behave, you'll run a little slower overall, but at least you'll be stable for the time being, and you can try incrementally increasing them a little bit until you find your fastest stable state. If it doesn't help, then it's possible you've got modules that flat out don't like each other.
Now if it's a matched set of RAM sticks, then you could have a problem with the system addressing a specific amount of RAM. That's either mainboard or CPU. This is where it would be best to see if you could test the board with the same amount of memory using a different pair of matched memory modules and seeing if the problem persists. I've also seen it where specific brands or specific models of RAM were incompatible with specific CPU's. That's rare, but it does happen, especially with cheaper "off-brand" or generic modules.
Since this is a problem with both modules in at once, it sounds like the 256 MB RAM modules you have are either from different manufacturers, and/or have different CAS latency timings, so give that a shot first. I hope it helps.
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I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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scalliano
Elite
Posts: 1095
Yup, that's me
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All 3 chips are different makes, so the timings seem like a good place to start. I'll give those a go tomorrow. Right now I'm off to the Euro server for some uninterrupted fragging  EDIT: After discovering that there was absolutely NO MISSION of getting a decent game of Gen on 256MB of RAM I decided to go ahead and check the BIOS again with both chips installed, hence my jumping in and out of the server tonight. The bank interleave was completely disabled. Also I couldn't find any options relating to CAS latency, so I couldn't check that out, but I tried all of the available options with no joy. Looks like new RAM is on the cards ... |
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« Last Edit: 2005-08-18, 22:15 by scalliano »
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PSN ID: scalliano
The Arena knows no gender, colour or creed, only skill.
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