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~Va^^pyrA~
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It's really sad that the people of this country are so brainwashed that they would fight against having proper healthcare. Mind you, what is being specifically proposed may not be "proper healthcare", per say, but more of a watered down gateway to such. The only reason it isn't a full, positive revamping of the system however is because people would reject that even more so. When I think about out-of-control spending, I can only look toward the military and our continuing occupation of needles areas of the world.  |
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Tabun
Pixel Procrastinator
Team Member
Elite (3k+)
   
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The thing that surprises me most is that "communism" is still as feared, and as much a red herring, as it was with McCarthyism.. Also:  . Also: is that number "up to 2 million" confirmed or planned? I'm hearing that there were about 60k people? |
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« Last Edit: 2009-09-14, 11:53 by Tabun »
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?Morituri Nolumus Mori? |
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~Va^^pyrA~
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I think the problem is that most people (on either side) are not thinking. They are not asking questions. They don't care about debate. They just want slogans to write on banners so that they have a team to root for.
Having lived in France for two years though, I can assure you that America's healthcare system is indeed broken. People are exploited and doctors and insurance companies get rich for doing little to nothing. Of course, other systems (such as the varying ones throughout Europe) have their own set of issues, but at least the groundwork is there.
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scalliano
Elite
Posts: 1095
Yup, that's me
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Then, of course, there's the business (and I do mean business) of "treatment" rather than "cure". Why deprive yourself of an income by curing someone's illness when you can ensure long-term fiscal security by putting them on a course of medication for the rest of their lives?
A government-funded healthcare system would probably be more interested in actually curing people as it would want to spend as little money as possible on treatment (exhibit A: the NHS).
This is qualified by the myriad of scare-stories about the National Institute for Clinical Excellence (NICE). All of them involving patients with terminal or long-term illnesses not getting the treatment they need because "it's too expensive".
I'm the first to admit that the NHS has its flaws, but healthcare should be a right, not a privilege.
And, yeah, some of those protesters are still living in the 50's.
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PSN ID: scalliano
The Arena knows no gender, colour or creed, only skill.
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Phoenix
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I have been seeing plenty of questions asked. People are asking, who is going to pay for this? Why should legislation be passed that nobody has had time to actually read? Why is spending out of control when there were promises to cut the deficit? Why are troops not being withdrawn as was promised? There are a lot of questions on both sides of the aisle right now. It is coverage of those questions that is lacking. The news is completely broken. If you're more conservative, you have talk radio and Fox News. If you're more liberal, you have MSNBC, the New York Times, etc. The internet is full of rumors and misinformation. Who is telling the truth? An individual has to try to decide for themselves, but depending on how you lean, you're more likely to believe one side or another.
As for health care, if you want care in America, you can pay for whatever you want, but if you cannot, a hospital cannot refuse treatment. Every system will have horror stories, this is true, and I agree that there's a tremendous amount of room for improvement in any system. I do have to ask though why it seems that the government is supposed to do this somehow better than the private sector. The government is, after all, in the business of spending other people's money and passing laws that tell people what they cannot do, and who regulates that? I don't understand why people would want more government control over their lives. Is the concept of self-determination dead among humans?
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  I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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scalliano
Elite
Posts: 1095
Yup, that's me
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In answer to your last question, probably.
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PSN ID: scalliano
The Arena knows no gender, colour or creed, only skill.
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Phoenix
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Here's a little gem. Apparently if you don't buy health care under Obama's plan, you are fined $1900. If you don't pay their $1900 fine, you are a criminal and can be fined and thrown in jail for up to a year and fined up to $25,000.
http://www.politico.com/livepulse/0909/E...s_handwritten_confirmation_.html?showall
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM110_090925_document2.html
To top it off, the health care would be managed by the IRS.
http://www.politico.com/livepulse/0909/F...andate_penalty_Face_the_IRS.html?showall
Not only is it the most hated government institution in America, it is also the only agency where the presumption of innocence is suspended and you must prove that you are not guilty or face fines and imprisonment. If this is what is considered proper health care, I can understand the opposition to it and I wholly agree with it. I see no provision for due process in this, it's "pay up or else". I can certainly understand a desire to help the poor and underprivileged obtain access to treatment, but why the emphasis on such strict punitive measures? Why force this upon people who do not want it? Why put it under IRS control? This stinks of tyranny. I see this more about controlling people's health care rather than meeting the needs of the poor. More government bloat, more revenue, more intrusive government control.
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I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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LunaG
Beta Tester
Baron of Hell
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In one of the comments in that first link, I LOL'ed at "They're gonna need a bigger jail."
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Woodsman
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I'm not sure i buy this "hand written confirmation".
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Phoenix
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Well you could always read the bill for yourself... 
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I fly into the night, on wings of fire burning bright...
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Woodsman
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tell you what pho if this whole plan goes through, and i am actually charged 1900 dollars by the goverment i will send my left testicle to the IRS.
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