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Author Topic: A European's Perspective (On European Anti-Americanism)  (Read 11824 times)
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Phoenix
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« on: 2003-11-27, 07:41 »

http://www.taemag.com/issues/articleid.177...icle_detail.asp

Tekhead dropped this in the chat room, and I felt it's a good read for anyone.  Whether you agree with it or not, it will make you think.  Be warned, it's long.
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« Reply #1 on: 2003-11-27, 09:59 »

Since my last post was swallowed up by the damned forum system, I'm just going to summarize what I tried to say.

European "Anti-Americanism" is largely exaggerated. First of all, that term implies hatred for a people just for being itself, and frankly, that's just not the case here.
The fact that Europeans view America as the "cowboy", "racist", "extremist", etc. is due to a large misunderstanding of fundamental American culture and discourse, and the actions of the most prominent and therefore most easily noticed people.
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Phoenix
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« Reply #2 on: 2003-11-28, 07:24 »

Which is precisely what is the author's point in the article.  The majority of the common populace in Europe is NOT anti-american.  It's just the squeaky wheels that are getting all the grease that make it look that way. Slipgate - Smile
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« Reply #3 on: 2003-11-28, 14:10 »

Reminds me much in the same of violent video gamers. o.o
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Woodsman
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« Reply #4 on: 2003-11-28, 16:48 »

i think we might not want to use the term european in this kind of subject matter. Europe is not one comunity but many comunitys with thier own opinions and objectives despite the united front they like to show when working against isreali interests.
 In all frankness i really couldnt care any less what europeans think of the united states. A socialist and culturely effete society is going to hate any country that is rich and has conflicts with countrys of poor brown people. Europe would do well to remeber that the united states isnt guilty of anything that they havent done a 100 times over.
« Last Edit: 2003-11-28, 17:01 by Woodsman » Logged
ReBoOt
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« Reply #5 on: 2003-11-28, 21:51 »

uhm yes im an european, that must mean that im anti-american... right... must rember that Slipgate - Wink
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dna
 
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« Reply #6 on: 2003-11-28, 23:33 »

Quote from: ReBoOt
uhm yes im an european, that must mean that im anti-american... right... must rember that Slipgate - Wink
Finally, it all makes sense.
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Phoenix
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« Reply #7 on: 2003-11-28, 23:41 »

Woods, I invite you to take the time to really delve into that article.  There's a lot there that proves what's really going on isn't how the news media likes to report it.  This is where we get into the "perception vs. reality" situation.  The common citizenry in Europe, for the most part, is not anti-american.  What you have is an elitist minority with the news media in bed with them who are responsible for generating this image as well as deceiving the gullible part of the population.  Unfortunately, that same minority also makes policy over there, so that's how things get portrayed.  The same fomula works in the US.  The idea that all Europeans hate America is every bit as untrue as the portrayal they're given of Americans as nothing but gun-toting cowboys or far-right religious fanatics or greedy heartless corporate business men, and that any of the three are out to devour the whole world.  While this might be true of some companies (Wal-Mart, anyone?) the political, religious, and cultural views in the US run a broad spectrum.  The same goes for Europe, and the various cultures within Europe.  That's a large part of the point of this article is trying to confront such stereotypical mindsets with the truth, as opposed to the perceived reality that's being perpetuated.

It is also right to call Europeans "Europeans" because Europe IS under one banner now.   You could almost, but not quite just yet, call it the "United States of Europe".  You have several member states that are subordinate to a larger super-state, in much the same way that the individual states in the US are under the Federal Government.  It's no different than calling Americans "Americans" regardless of which state they are from.
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Woolie Wool
 
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« Reply #8 on: 2003-11-29, 04:34 »

I agree. It's partly envy and partly dismissal of one's failures that drives these people to portray America as an evil, piggish duality between the Hamptons and downtown Detroit.
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Kain-Xavier
 

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« Reply #9 on: 2003-11-30, 12:15 »

Great article.  A bit lengthy for my tastes though.

My thoughts:
No one personal observatation or even a group's observation can truly pin-point the cause behind something.  Life is heuristic not algorithmic.  With that in mind, I do have a hard time taking this article as the absolute truth, especially since it is highly opinionated.  Just because you provide countless examples that represent your opinion, does not make them the truth.  However, I do agree with the article a great deal.

The author kept putting forth the example of only the socially/politcial/monetary elite becoming representative of a nation.  This occurs in other aspects of life beside foreign relations as well.  When the term "elite" is used, it represents an extreme diversion from the average, good or bad.  So let's focus on the negative extreme for my example.  Three students graduated from the University of Advancing Technology, a school that specializes in different aspects of the videogame industry, and are hired by Rainbow Studios, a nearby company, to be AI programmers.  Out of the particular three, there is one that stands  out among them.  This is not because he has strong leadership qualities, but simply because he's very boistrous and argumentive, not to mention cocky.  He could very well be the best programmer out of the three, but Rainbow Studios is not going to tolerate his bull-crap and his constant arguing.  They are going to disband him, possibly the other two, and forever blacklist UAT.  Why?  Simply because this schmuck was a representative of the school and not only that, but was the "elite" member of the three.  Game creation is a serious money-making business, companies can't afford to burned by employees who disrupt the team or don't want to work.  Thus they and their associations are labeled.

The other problem is that people love to shift blame.  Why try to take responsibility?  Hell I can sue and get a large monetary compensation if I don't take responsibilty.  Or I could just keep telling people one thing and they'll believe me simply because I'm an "elite."  Blah, blah, blah, rant, rant, rant, and so on... Of course, this example is highly opinionated. Slipgate - Laugh

I think I'm done now.
« Last Edit: 2003-11-30, 21:35 by Kain-Xavier » Logged

WolfCub
 

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« Reply #10 on: 2003-11-30, 15:15 »

I am Canadian and I have American relatives. America has bad things like every other country, but it is not a bad place. I like my American relatives as much as my Canadian relatives. What has America done to be hated so much? Some poeple are just looking for someone to hate.
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Phoenix
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« Reply #11 on: 2003-12-01, 06:32 »

Quote from: WolfCub
Some poeple are just looking for someone to hate.
I think that sums it up the best.
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