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Author Topic: Railguns vs Nailguns (Which weapon?)  (Read 28312 times)
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shambler
 
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« Reply #60 on: 2004-02-19, 22:11 »

I'm new to Gen so have been sticking with what I know best, but I see what you mean and understand. It will give me the incentive to try other classes a lot more for some maps, although deep down Q1 has always been my first love. (after Helen, my Banjo playing northumbrian fishermans daughter, I better say, in case she reads this)    Slipgate - Smile
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Tabun
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« Reply #61 on: 2004-02-20, 01:19 »

When you're up for it, try the random class mode for a bit. I don't think I'd like Gen as much without it ;]
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Tabun ?Morituri Nolumus Mori?
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« Reply #62 on: 2004-02-20, 16:22 »

Random class is a blast!
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shambler
 
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« Reply #63 on: 2004-02-20, 17:21 »

Can't play this saturday, due to a gig, but I will give random a go next time.
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MoJoJoJoe
 
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« Reply #64 on: 2004-02-26, 22:37 »

The last beta I used was .99a. Also I undrstand the balance problem, but the difference between an unbalanced game and an unskilled player is very thin. If you were to make all classes have the original phisics (speed, armor, damage, jumping, etc.) that would definitally lean more towards skill based combat insted of ballanced combat. The kind of thing you would have SP. Or MP if you wanted to attract hardcore gamers. Also the only reason doom walked on water was because at the time there was no such thing as swimming in first person shooters. And he couldn't look up or down because of the game not being 3D as everyone knows it is just 8 views around of a 2D creature. If you were to use a source port that had freelook you would notice if you look down from a ledge at enemies they were incredible at backbends and warping their body's shape. Slipgate - Laugh

Also jumping wasn't possible at the time either.
« Last Edit: 2004-02-26, 22:39 by MoJoJoJoe » Logged
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« Reply #65 on: 2004-02-26, 22:43 »

Mojo: balance is the key to Gen. If we left things at 100% of their original values, Doom and Slipgate would own all. Earth and Strogg wouldn't stand a CHANCE. There would be no reason, at all, to play them. Unless you just LIKE being beat.....
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Tabun
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« Reply #66 on: 2004-02-27, 02:23 »

Also, what is speed and damage measured in? In units/sec and points respectively. Sure, you can toss all this together in one mod, but who says the values are all on the same scale? For damage it may seem obvious, since we're talking percentile values here, but if you take the armor systems in consideration, things get complicated. Speed, size and distance all seem different in the games, and using exact translations (see mapping) destroys the game. Entirely.

But I think I can speak for all of us, when I say we're glad to have you back Mojo! I haven't read a post such as the above in a long time, and frankly, I'd started to miss it.
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Tabun ?Morituri Nolumus Mori?
Phoenix
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« Reply #67 on: 2004-02-27, 07:15 »

Id software used 8 units ~ 1 foot since Wolfenstein 3D up to Quake 3.  Now, Doom moved at probably 650 units/second, if my memory is right (too lazy to look at the source right now).  He could ALMOST catch his own rockets.  That equates to:

650 units / 8 units in a foot  =
81.25 feet/second * 60 seconds =
4875 feet/minute * 60 minutes =
292500 feet/hour / 5280 feet in a mile =
55.40 miles per hour.

For reference, standard Quake 3 movement rate is 320 units/second.

This is NOT counting the wall-running trick where you can outrun PLASMA.  Imagine making Doom that fast and giving him that 100 to 300 point hand cannon from Doom II?  Even Slipgate with 200 red armor at pickup could not touch that kind of firepower and speed.  Generations would be pointless.  Skill goes out the window when one factor overbalances every other.  This is why we've tweaked the way we do.  We try to keep things as authentic as possible without destroying the game for every other class.
« Last Edit: 2004-02-27, 07:17 by Phoenix » Logged


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« Reply #68 on: 2004-02-27, 07:24 »

Well if we were gonna make it truly accurate to the originals, Strogg most certainly would NOT be helpless. I have two words for you: Power. Shield.
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« Reply #69 on: 2004-02-27, 07:35 »

hahahha...put it in place of the berserk for strogg?

Hmm....that's an interesting idea...

I'm kidding!
*hides from Pho*
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Phoenix
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« Reply #70 on: 2004-02-27, 07:58 »

Well... actually, as a Strogg-only powerup, I might be able to live with that, since Strogg has no benefit from the Berserker, and tends to get his ass kicked a lot.  I could just reuse the PW_BERSERK slot.  Hmmmmm....
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« Reply #71 on: 2004-02-27, 07:59 »

Whoa. I thought you HATED the power armor.

Think it out VERY carefully though. There's some maps with a BUTTLOAD of cells.
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Phoenix
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« Reply #72 on: 2004-02-27, 08:08 »

In Q2 I do, but remember, Q2 is a single-class game where you don't have Doomers and Slipgaters kicking the crap out of you at close range on a regular basis.  An "across the board" power armor I would never allow in Gen.  However, a Strogg-only power armor, like I said, I might, that is, MIGHT be able to live with.  Another option would be to implement the power screen that was only in place for the Brains monsters but had an actual player item coded.  The screen only blocked damage from the front.  A skilled player could work around that.  Still, this is just an "idea" at the moment, and nothing more either way.

The berserker is also not that common an item, and a screen/armor would be a bit more of a benefit for the Q2 grunts than just a standard medkit. Of course, you no longer get the medkit if it works as a power armor.
« Last Edit: 2004-02-27, 08:12 by Phoenix » Logged


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« Reply #73 on: 2004-02-27, 11:44 »

well we can give slipgate back the  

The Empathy Shield
Pick up the Empathy Shield and half of the pain inflicted upon you by enemies is sent right back at them!

that would keep some guys away from you , although you still take damage yourself .
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Tekhead
 
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« Reply #74 on: 2004-02-27, 13:15 »

OOH!! I knew something was missing from the strogger!! Power Armor (or the screen)!!!
Yes! Definitely go for it Slipgate - Laugh
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Tabun
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« Reply #75 on: 2004-02-27, 13:32 »

omg.. that is such a cool idea :]
It should be a little less effective (or timed?) than the original, because that was insane, but very cool indeed..
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Tabun ?Morituri Nolumus Mori?
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« Reply #76 on: 2004-02-27, 19:45 »

O.o buhWHAAA? As if strogg can't get enough armor as-is! Slipgate - Tongue

Sounds like fun though Slipgate - Tongue

Oh, and pho: a hasted doomer is about the speed the player was in doom.

Only problem is, q3 handles gravity different, in doom you kinda stuck to the floor. It's easiest to point out in the 2fort remake in the ctf mappack. a flag dropped on the stairs is a pain in the ASS for a hasted doomer to grab at full-tilt. But that's a minor consideration. Doom moving at his oldschool speed would be EVIL, and I don't know how/if that would kill gameplay.
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